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Can you be saved but not bear any fruit?

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  • #16
    Matthew 7 is often cited, but the context is often overlooked:

    Matthew 7: 15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. 16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? 17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. 19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. 20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. 21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

    So, the context is that we will know false prophets by their fruit. Who and what do they gather around them, what are they teaching? If they are plucking the poison fruit of Word of Faith, for example, we know to stay away from them. Notice that they, on the surface, have done "many wonderful works," but that without preaching the true Jesus along with grace and faith, it is worse than empty.

    Thanks to sweeetlilgurlie on Narniaweb for the sig

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    • #17
      I agree with your post but it must not only apply to false teachers or we would not all be told to go and bear fruits. I'm still wondering about man's fruits in general. He tells us to bear fruit and since I know fruit & works are not the same, and love joy peace, etc. is the HS's fruits (gifts to us) and not the fruits that we humans bare, what are the fruits that man bares? My assumption would be that it's the things we do which come from God's character in us like being compassionate or doing a good job at work, being a good friend, etc. But that's all works too so what is the fruits part? Look at John 15:16, go and bear fruit, lasting fruit. What is that fruit and how do we make sure it's the lasting kind?

      John 15:1 “I am the true vine, and my Father is the gardener. 2 He cuts off every branch in me that bears no fruit, while every branch that does bear fruit he prunes[a] so that it will be even more fruitful. 3 You are already clean because of the word I have spoken to you. 4 Remain in me, as I also remain in you. No branch can bear fruit by itself; it must remain in the vine. Neither can you bear fruit unless you remain in me.

      5 “I am the vine; you are the branches. If you remain in me and I in you, you will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing. 6 If you do not remain in me, you are like a branch that is thrown away and withers; such branches are picked up, thrown into the fire and burned. 7 If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be done for you. 8 This is to my Father’s glory, that you bear much fruit, showing yourselves to be my disciples.

      In Genesis we are told to be fruitful and multiply, ie. have children. But what other things would be considered "bearing fruit" that is not a work?

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      • #18
        Man's fruit is always rotten, even if it looks good on the outside. In the life of a Christian, if we give our will over to God, our fruit is the fruit of the Spirit. Good only comes from God, hence, good fruit originates with Him. I guess what I'm saying is that we are told that man's righteousness (notice it's man's righteousness, not his evil) that is like filthy rags.

        It is accounted to us for righteousness when we respond to God in faith. We are saved by faith and live by faith, that sanctification faith results in seeing fruit in our life, but that fruit comes from the Spirit, and then we yield to Him in guidance. For example, if we are generous and give to charity and if that is an actual good fruit, it had to originate with the Spirit. So, in effect, believers' fruit is synonymous with the fruit of the Holy Spirit. Even if it is something like being a good leader, that's a gift.

        This is a huge reason why we should be humble in our walk and around others, any good didn't originate with us.

        Thanks to sweeetlilgurlie on Narniaweb for the sig

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        • #19
          So in your opinion do you think it would be a correct summation that man's fruits are simply the works that the HS does through us? Since the gifts of the HS were capabilities given to men to use in their own power like speaking in tongues or healing the sick, could we say that that the works of the Holy Spirit are not really powers He gives us but things He compels us to do? So in effect the fruits of man are the works done through us. That really makes sense when you consider He is the vine, we are the branches. The vine is doing all the work nourishing and watering the fruit, and the fruit just grows because the vine is good and knows what it's doing.

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          • #20
            In a way, the fruit is the product of the vine but the burden of the branch.
            The heavens are telling of the glory of God; And their expanse is declaring the work of His hands.
            Day to day pours forth speech, And night to night reveals knowledge.
            (Psa 19:1b-2)

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            • #21
              Originally posted by LeafyTree View Post
              So in your opinion do you think it would be a correct summation that man's fruits are simply the works that the HS does through us? Since the gifts of the HS were capabilities given to men to use in their own power like speaking in tongues or healing the sick, could we say that that the works of the Holy Spirit are not really powers He gives us but things He compels us to do? So in effect the fruits of man are the works done through us. That really makes sense when you consider He is the vine, we are the branches. The vine is doing all the work nourishing and watering the fruit, and the fruit just grows because the vine is good and knows what it's doing.
              Yeah, that's kind of how I think scripture reads, and what Hoot' was saying metaphorically. I think the role that we play is that we yield to the Spirit, to trust Him. I do think that God then counts that for righteousness, and hence that is good fruit. To take a preacher for an example, they can't be a good preacher unless given a gift by the Spirit, and because of that gift that preacher will gather good fruit, as well as evidencing the fruit of the Spirit.

              Thanks to sweeetlilgurlie on Narniaweb for the sig

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              • #22
                At first reading of Hoot's post it didn't click, but then reading Kliska's post i totally get what Hoot was saying also. We are the branches, it is our burden (a joyful burden) to do the works of the HS which is the fruit. The fruits of righteousness are the outward proofs of our submission to the HS. Thanks for helping me step through that.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by LeafyTree View Post
                  At first reading of Hoot's post it didn't click, but then reading Kliska's post i totally get what Hoot was saying also. We are the branches, it is our burden (a joyful burden) to do the works of the HS which is the fruit. The fruits of righteousness are the outward proofs of our submission to the HS. Thanks for helping me step through that.
                  I think with God, He still makes it clear we have a will, and we can either yield that will over, or not. I think that explains how it can be a fruit of the Spirit, working through us, yet still yield rewards for us at the Bema seat judgment (even though it isn't about the rewards for us).

                  Thanks to sweeetlilgurlie on Narniaweb for the sig

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                  • #24
                    Galatians 5:19 (KJV) 19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are [these]; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,

                    Galatians 5:20 (KJV) 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

                    Galatians 5:21 (KJV) 21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told [you] in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

                    Those are man's fruits

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                    • #25
                      GotQuestions.org

                      And this answers quite simply what a man of God and a woman of God are.

                      http://www.gotquestions.org/man-of-God.html

                      http://www.gotquestions.org/woman-of-God.html

                      Not that men and women of God do not sin; but that they earnestly seek to conform their minds and their purposes to God's calling on their lives.
                      Mary Brown

                      John 15:18-25

                      Revelation 4:1
                      New International Version (©1984)
                      After this I looked, and there before me was a door standing open in heaven. And the voice I had first heard speaking to me like a trumpet said, "Come up here, and I will show you what must take place after this."

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by LeafyTree View Post
                        But what other things would be considered "bearing fruit" that is not a work?
                        Works and deeds can fool other men, but not God. I find in life that the fruit of the Spirit cannot be faked, hence why we are told to look for it, rather than any particular behavior. Men have tried to use their deeds to justify themselves, even at the sheep and the goat judgment we get men pointing to their deeds, like it matters. If God doesn't make the tree good, born again producing good fruit, it will not bear good fruit, but works can always be done.
                        Don't panic! Just be Rapture Ready.

                        Joel 3:2

                        I will gather all nations and bring them down to the Valley of Jehoshaphat. There I will put them on trial for what they did to my inheritance, my people Israel, because they scattered my people among the nations and divided up my land.

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                        • #27
                          Every Scriptural instance talking about "fruit" and "fruitfulness" has to be answered according to the context of the passage. Some passages about good fruit like the one that started this thread, John 15:6. Others are talling about evil fruit, like the one Kliska answered with from Matthew 7, the fruit in context meaning the evil deeds of false teachers. There is no single answer to cover every instance of where Scripture talks about "fruit." False teachers look good on the outside like a whitewashed tomb, but are full of dead men's bones inside.

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