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10 Commandments in the Age of Grace

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  • 10 Commandments in the Age of Grace

    Alright guys, time to ask here cause google keeps pulling up SDA interpretations and I can't deal with that headache anymore. Study guides are welcomed and discussion as well.

    So here are my questions

    1) If Christ fulfilled the Law (Mosaic) then that should be over and done correct? (Please no red herring "giving license to sin" argument.)

    2) With verses like Galatians 5:1-4 it seems to imply a need to resist going back to the law as a "yardstick" correct?

    3) 10 commandments are they or are they not apart of the WHOLE law?

    4) Is this less confusing than I'm making it?

    I keep hearing a lot these days that if you refuse to follow the 10 commandments you are not saved (no I don't really care about their opinions regarding that) you are some disobedient heretic. The only other troubling argument is the "we love Christ so we are going to follow them!" which is why I brought up Galatians 5:1-4 and I know we here know about Acts and Peter and James not wanting to yolk Gentiles with something they couldn't even do. To me the Commandments give us great insight into the Holy Holy Holiness of God! When ever I fail at one (not that I try to) it just humbles me to think I can't even keep the basic part of it and Jesus did it fully!

    The fruit of the Spirit seems to be more of the guideline for us in the Age of the Gentiles correct? Galatians 5:22-23

    I'll leave this as it is for now as I'm sure more questions will arise.

    Thank you!
    Romans 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

  • #2
    Originally posted by BorrowedTime View Post
    Alright guys, time to ask here cause google keeps pulling up SDA interpretations and I can't deal with that headache anymore. Study guides are welcomed and discussion as well.

    So here are my questions

    1) If Christ fulfilled the Law (Mosaic) then that should be over and done correct? (Please no red herring "giving license to sin" argument.)

    2) With verses like Galatians 5:1-4 it seems to imply a need to resist going back to the law as a "yardstick" correct?

    3) 10 commandments are they or are they not apart of the WHOLE law?

    4) Is this less confusing than I'm making it?

    I keep hearing a lot these days that if you refuse to follow the 10 commandments you are not saved (no I don't really care about their opinions regarding that) you are some disobedient heretic. The only other troubling argument is the "we love Christ so we are going to follow them!" which is why I brought up Galatians 5:1-4 and I know we here know about Acts and Peter and James not wanting to yolk Gentiles with something they couldn't even do. To me the Commandments give us great insight into the Holy Holy Holiness of God! When ever I fail at one (not that I try to) it just humbles me to think I can't even keep the basic part of it and Jesus did it fully!

    The fruit of the Spirit seems to be more of the guideline for us in the Age of the Gentiles correct? Galatians 5:22-23

    I'll leave this as it is for now as I'm sure more questions will arise.

    Thank you!
    1. Yes it's over and done with in the sense we'll never ever be able to not sin until we become fully perfected, living eternally with God. Perhaps a useful link: https://answersingenesis.org/answers...the-moral-law/
    2. Hmm not sure how to explain. I interpret these verses to mean this is the ultimate that He knows we can't achieve. But we still should strive for yet recognize we cannot, will not ever be able to do of ourselves but can someday through God.
    3. I consider the 10 Commandments part of the moral law (see link I have above). This is part of "the law" but distinct from others like the laws from Old Testament. I guess in simplest form, the 10 commandments apply to all of us in the past and currently. Some of the stuff like Jewish laws, eating kosher, wearing certain fabrics, sacrificing animals etc those were meant for the Jews and were for the past. They don't apply now because Jesus came.
    4. I dunno
    Regarding fruits of the spirit I think this is not salvation related but sanctification related. Using the gifts of God to fulfill the things He would have us do here, again, knowing we'll never attain perfection at it here on Earth.
    The way I think of it is this: you're saved by admitting we're no good (no works are enough) and never will be apart from Christ (because of grace). After salvation the rest of our life is a sllowwwww process moving towards sanctification, trying to follow the 10 commandments, showing fruit of the Holy Spirit, doing works as a show of or outgrowth of our faith but they can't save us and we'll never get an A+. Take a standardized test as example. No matter how hard you work, how good you do, you can't ever achieve 100-percentile because it's impossible to do better than 100% of the people that took the test because that includes you. But you can strive for the 99.99percentile!
    I hope I didn't make this worse
    Toots

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by BlessdMomUv5 View Post
      1. Yes it's over and done with in the sense we'll never ever be able to not sin until we become fully perfected, living eternally with God. Perhaps a useful link: https://answersingenesis.org/answers...the-moral-law/
      Good read thank you!

      2. Hmm not sure how to explain. I interpret these verses to mean this is the ultimate that He knows we can't achieve. But we still should strive for yet recognize we cannot, will not ever be able to do of ourselves but can someday through God.
      The part that strikes me is when he says you are a debtor to the whole of the law. Further to be continued in 3)

      3. I consider the 10 Commandments part of the moral law (see link I have above). This is part of "the law" but distinct from others like the laws from Old Testament. I guess in simplest form, the 10 commandments apply to all of us in the past and currently. Some of the stuff like Jewish laws, eating kosher, wearing certain fabrics, sacrificing animals etc those were meant for the Jews and were for the past. They don't apply now because Jesus came.
      I don't see anywhere in the Bible up to Romans where there is any distinction. Even when the Bible says Laws of Moses the 10 Commandments get quoted. Deuteronomy 5 really seems to make no separation between moral vs ceremonial.

      So if the 10 commandments are apart of Mosaic Law they would be left in the past where Christ had fulfilled them. Now Paul goes on to write about not breaking 9 out of 10 of them (clearly he has no issues with Sabbath breaking vs keeping) but it seems as they are apart of the Laws of Christ not Mosaic. But there is no doubt that Paul wrote about Mosaic as a curse, bondage, slavery and that Christ nailed them all to the Cross.

      So best way without full circling this, Mosaic Law, then Christ died, new covenant new rules. The common thing SDA's/Lordship spout out is "we keep the commandments cause we love Jesus" even though Christ has died and come.


      4. I dunno
      Neither do I :-P

      Regarding fruits of the spirit I think this is not salvation related but sanctification related. Using the gifts of God to fulfill the things He would have us do here, again, knowing we'll never attain perfection at it here on Earth.
      The way I think of it is this: you're saved by admitting we're no good (no works are enough) and never will be apart from Christ (because of grace). After salvation the rest of our life is a sllowwwww process moving towards sanctification, trying to follow the 10 commandments, showing fruit of the Holy Spirit, doing works as a show of or outgrowth of our faith but they can't save us and we'll never get an A+. Take a standardized test as example. No matter how hard you work, how good you do, you can't ever achieve 100-percentile because it's impossible to do better than 100% of the people that took the test because that includes you. But you can strive for the 99.99percentile!
      I hope I didn't make this worse
      Not worse than it already is.
      Romans 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by BorrowedTime View Post
        ...
        Now Paul goes on to write about not breaking 9 out of 10 of them (clearly he has no issues with Sabbath breaking vs keeping) but it seems as they are apart of the Laws of Christ not Mosaic.
        ...
        Are you talking about in general Paul wrote about this,
        or did he say something specific about those commandments?

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by TRex2 View Post
          Are you talking about in general Paul wrote about this,
          or did he say something specific about those commandments?
          In general is what I meant
          Romans 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by BorrowedTime View Post

            1) If Christ fulfilled the Law (Mosaic) then that should be over and done correct? (Please no red herring "giving license to sin" argument.)
            The Law of Moses has been rendered inoperative.

            Christ is the end of the Law - that includes all 613 commandments.
            Romans 10:4 (NAS)
            4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

            We can not be justified by the Law.
            Galatians 2:16
            16 nevertheless knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the Law but through faith in Christ Jesus, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, so that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the Law; since by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified.

            There is no sanctification or perfection through the Law.
            Hebrews 7:19
            19 (for the Law made nothing perfect ), and on the other hand there is a bringing in of a better hope, through which we draw near to God.

            The Law was never meant to be permanent administration, but a temporary one.
            Galatians 3:19
            19 Why, then, was the law given at all? It was added because of transgressions until the Seed to whom the promise referred had come. The law was given through angels and entrusted to a mediator

            The Levitical Priesthood was imperfect and was replaced by the Priesthood of Mechizedek. Hebrews 9 and 10 shows that animal blood could not bring perfection, only Jesus' blood can do that.
            Hebrews 7:11-12, 18
            11 Now if perfection was through the Levitical priesthood (for on the basis of it the people received the Law ), what further need was there for another priest to arise according to the order of Melchizedek, and not be designated according to the order of Aaron?
            12 For when the priesthood is changed, of necessity there takes place a change of law also

            18 For, on the one hand, there is a setting aside of a former commandment because of its weakness and uselessness


            The Law of Moses and especially the 10 Commandments have passed away or rendered inoperative.
            See 2 Corinthians 3:2-11

            Believers are now under a new Law - the Law of Christ
            Galatians 6:2
            2 Bear one another's burdens, and thereby fulfill the law of Christ.

            Any commandments given to believers and the Church in the New Testament are requirements of Christ's Law. In fact, of the original 10 Commandments given to Moses, 9 of the 10 are upheld in the Law of Christ. The only one not upheld is to keep the Sabbath. There are other laws that changed, though, under Mosaic Law eating pork was not permitted, but under the Law of Christ, this is not a commandment. Christ Himself gave us a new commandment, to love one another as He loved us.

            Think of it this way, I was born in Illinois and while living there had to follow the state traffic laws of Illinois, I now live in Missouri and no longer follow Illinois traffic laws, but rather Missouri traffic laws. EDITED TO ADD: Some of the laws for Illinois may be the same as for Missouri, Illinois may list some that don't apply to Missouri and Missouri may list some that don't apply to Illinois. Now that I live and drive in Missouri, the traffic laws of Illinois are inoperative for me, I now follow Missouri traffic laws.
            John 14:6
            Jesus answered, "I am the WAY and the TRUTH and the LIFE, no one comes to the Father except through Me."

            Comment


            • #7
              I was wondering today about the Sabbath. We know from history that the Puritans kept the Sabbath, and for a long time, many businesses stayed closed on Sunday. These current times most people treat Sunday as just another busy day in their week. I have heard that there is a saying now, "Sunday Fun-day". I know people say we don't need to keep the commandment about the Sabbath, but it seems like Christians at least used to honor God more on Sunday than they do now. Probably out of love for Jesus and not for keeping the law. I think in a way it is a shame we don't honor God more on Sundays.
              "Therefore my beloved brothers, be steadfast, immovable,
              always abounding in the work of the Lord;
              knowing that in the Lord your labor is not in vain."

              1 Corinthians 15:58 (ESV)

              Comment


              • #8
                From my understanding, the Sabbath was a Hebrew holy day set by God. It has always been and still is on the day we call Saturday. For the Jew it is the 7th day of the week, starting at sundown on Friday through sundown on Saturday.

                The early church, as recorded in scripture often would meet on Sunday, or simply known to the Hebrews as "the first day of the week". But, we know from Paul that we are not obligated to meet on Sundays only: Romans 14:5. Galatians 4:9-10. Colossians 2:16-17. It is traditions of men that sought to make Sunday the new Sabbath day and not scripture.

                I too remember the blue laws of my childhood. Sundays for me were about church, worship, family, afternoon games, reading and resting. Personally, I liked these quiet days when the world seemed to shut down. Although, there were sometimes inconveniences with this practice. But, from a scriptural stand-point, a "blue-day Sunday" was not instituted by the Bible. However, I think what Paul is talking about in Romans 14:5, Paul's practice to me infers that he worshiped and fellowshipped on any given day or more precisely, every given day of the week. But, he also allowed for some to consider one day holier than another ("let each man be fully assured in his own mind.")

                EDITED TO ADD: That Sundays no longer seem holy, I think is a reflection of our times. Preachers used to complain about Sunday worshipers - who sinned the rest of the week. Now we have far fewer of even the Sunday worshipers.
                John 14:6
                Jesus answered, "I am the WAY and the TRUTH and the LIFE, no one comes to the Father except through Me."

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Trust&Obey View Post

                  The Law of Moses has been rendered inoperative.

                  Christ is the end of the Law - that includes all 613 commandments.
                  Romans 10:4 (NAS)
                  4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

                  We can not be justified by the Law.
                  Galatians 2:16
                  16 nevertheless knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the Law but through faith in Christ Jesus, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, so that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the Law; since by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified.

                  There is no sanctification or perfection through the Law.
                  Hebrews 7:19
                  19 (for the Law made nothing perfect ), and on the other hand there is a bringing in of a better hope, through which we draw near to God.

                  The Law was never meant to be permanent administration, but a temporary one.
                  Galatians 3:19
                  19 Why, then, was the law given at all? It was added because of transgressions until the Seed to whom the promise referred had come. The law was given through angels and entrusted to a mediator

                  The Levitical Priesthood was imperfect and was replaced by the Priesthood of Mechizedek. Hebrews 9 and 10 shows that animal blood could not bring perfection, only Jesus' blood can do that.
                  Hebrews 7:11-12, 18
                  11 Now if perfection was through the Levitical priesthood (for on the basis of it the people received the Law ), what further need was there for another priest to arise according to the order of Melchizedek, and not be designated according to the order of Aaron?
                  12 For when the priesthood is changed, of necessity there takes place a change of law also

                  18 For, on the one hand, there is a setting aside of a former commandment because of its weakness and uselessness


                  The Law of Moses and especially the 10 Commandments have passed away or rendered inoperative.
                  See 2 Corinthians 3:2-11

                  Believers are now under a new Law - the Law of Christ
                  Galatians 6:2
                  2 Bear one another's burdens, and thereby fulfill the law of Christ.

                  Any commandments given to believers and the Church in the New Testament are requirements of Christ's Law. In fact, of the original 10 Commandments given to Moses, 9 of the 10 are upheld in the Law of Christ. The only one not upheld is to keep the Sabbath. There are other laws that changed, though, under Mosaic Law eating pork was not permitted, but under the Law of Christ, this is not a commandment. Christ Himself gave us a new commandment, to love one another as He loved us.

                  Think of it this way, I was born in Illinois and while living there had to follow the state traffic laws of Illinois, I now live in Missouri and no longer follow Illinois traffic laws, but rather Missouri traffic laws. EDITED TO ADD: Some of the laws for Illinois may be the same as for Missouri, Illinois may list some that don't apply to Missouri and Missouri may list some that don't apply to Illinois. Now that I live and drive in Missouri, the traffic laws of Illinois are inoperative for me, I now follow Missouri traffic laws.
                  Good post! I was recently in a discussion with a SDA who said there is another gospel out there.
                  When I asked him what this other gospel was, he had this to say below:


                  "It is a gospel that tries to separate God's Law (10 commandments) from the Cross. The counterfeit gospel is out there. It is a gospel that tries to separate God's 10 commandments from the plan of salvation. Godís Law has always been part of the true gospel of Christ. The counterfeit gospel does not have it. God's forever Law (the 10 commandments) is the foundation of both the Old and the New Covenant and the very foundation and basis of the true gospel of Christ."


                  Of course, that is absolutely FALSE. According to his false gospel, salvation is by "grace plus law, faith plus works." His gospel is a subtle mixture of law and grace that is a perversion of the gospel. (Galatians 1:6-9). In regards to the 10 commandments, references for 9 of the 10 commandments under the Old Covenant are reiterated under the New Covenant, yet the command to keep the Sabbath day is not binding on Christians under the New Covenant.

                  1. You shall have no other gods before Me. - Acts 14:15
                  2. You shall make no idols. - 1 John 5:21
                  3. You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain. - James 5:12
                  4. Keep the Sabbath day holy. - Not binding on the Church - Colossians 2:16-17
                  5. Honor your father and your mother. - Ephesians 6:1-2
                  6. You shall not murder. - Romans 13:9-10; 1 John 3:15
                  7. You shall not commit adultery. - Romans 13:9-10; 1 Corinthians 6:9-10
                  8. You shall not steal. - Romans 13:9-10; Ephesians 4:28
                  9. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor. - Romans 13:9-10; Colossians 3:9-10
                  10. You shall not covet. - Romans 13:9-10; Ephesians 5:3

                  Sabbath keeping with all it's rules and regulations, was part of a covenant with Israel (Exodus 16:23, 29; 31:12-18; 35:1-3; Leviticus 19:30; 23:2-3, 32; Numbers 15:32-36; 28:1-10; 29:39-40; I Chronicles. 23:30-31; II Chronicles 31:2-4; Isaiah 1:13; Amos 8:5; Nehemiah 10:31) that is not binding on Christians under the New Covenant.

                  *Colossians 2:16 - Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day 17 things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.
                  Last edited by Mailmandan; January 29th, 2018, 11:07 AM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Mailmandan, enjoyed your post! On a more personal note, I've wondered why someone hasn't drawn up a list of laws that are written for the Church in the New Testament (besides the 9 of 10 of the original 10 commandments) and thanks partly to your post I realized that believers might again strive to fulfill this law with works instead of faith.

                    Galatians 2:16
                    16 nevertheless knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the Law but through faith in Christ Jesus, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, so that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the Law; since by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified.
                    John 14:6
                    Jesus answered, "I am the WAY and the TRUTH and the LIFE, no one comes to the Father except through Me."

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Some thoughts.

                      Originally posted by BorrowedTime View Post
                      Alright guys, time to ask here cause google keeps pulling up SDA interpretations and I can't deal with that headache anymore. Study guides are welcomed and discussion as well.

                      So here are my questions

                      1) If Christ fulfilled the Law (Mosaic) then that should be over and done correct? (Please no red herring "giving license to sin" argument.)
                      Correct. It is a new covenant. He spoke much about how the two cannot be combined.

                      Originally posted by BorrowedTime View Post
                      2) With verses like Galatians 5:1-4 it seems to imply a need to resist going back to the law as a "yardstick" correct?
                      Correct. The yardstick will always measure us short, so there is no hope in it.

                      Originally posted by BorrowedTime View Post
                      3) 10 commandments are they or are they not apart of the WHOLE law?
                      Yes, they are.

                      Originally posted by BorrowedTime View Post
                      4) Is this less confusing than I'm making it?
                      No. It just appears confusing because you read how the old covenant is not our covenant, and others attempt to pick and choose what they demand others follow.

                      Originally posted by BorrowedTime View Post
                      I keep hearing a lot these days that if you refuse to follow the 10 commandments you are not saved (no I don't really care about their opinions regarding that) you are some disobedient heretic. The only other troubling argument is the "we love Christ so we are going to follow them!" which is why I brought up Galatians 5:1-4 and I know we here know about Acts and Peter and James not wanting to yolk Gentiles with something they couldn't even do. To me the Commandments give us great insight into the Holy Holy Holiness of God! When ever I fail at one (not that I try to) it just humbles me to think I can't even keep the basic part of it and Jesus did it fully!

                      The fruit of the Spirit seems to be more of the guideline for us in the Age of the Gentiles correct? Galatians 5:22-23

                      I'll leave this as it is for now as I'm sure more questions will arise.

                      Thank you!
                      The fruit of the Spirit is to tell whether we, or perhaps others, are walking in the Spirit.

                      Notice its descriptors make no mention of law.

                      I think, in general, people like to have laws, and "prove" themselves by their adherence to (partial) law following, found in the old covenant.

                      Christ took it all away, left it ambiguous, if you will. That is a problem for people who simply must have a law to measure themselves with, or worse, measure others. They've not understood, or do not know they should measure themselves by the fruit of the Spirit, if measuring is what they want to do.

                      "Love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control"

                      What law can produce these? None.

                      These, you can keep, these, you can live by. They are products of the Holy Spirit working in your life. They cannot be faked, they cannot be 'acted', they are there or they are not, all because Christ is there, or He is not, in the persons soul.

                      Hope that helps a little bit.
                      Don't panic! Just be Rapture Ready.

                      Joel 3:2

                      I will gather all nations and bring them down to the Valley of Jehoshaphat. There I will put them on trial for what they did to my inheritance, my people Israel, because they scattered my people among the nations and divided up my land.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        While most of these responses are actually great responses, I think maybe I will give it a try. Romans 7:7-9 King James Version (KJV)

                        7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

                        Jesus also said John 14:15-17 15If ye love me, keep my commandments.

                        16And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; 17Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

                        So ultimately, the 10 commandments is to know when we sin. Jesus didn't just keep the 10 commandments he fulfilled the whole Jewish law. We don't have to keep the animal sacrifices or all the other things, but the 10 commandments are carried over to the new testament. This seems to be the biggest question that I hear. We are called to repent daily, correct? What are you to repent from? Is it not the law of the commandments that you know how you are sinning?
                        The 9th Commandment is Thou shalt not bear false witness.
                        The 4th Remember the Sabbath day and keep it Holy. Do you lie about someone and not repent of that?
                        The Sabbath yes was kept on Saturday in the Old Covenant(testament) but we are suppose to keep Sunday, why, Paul did, because it was the 1st day of the week that Our Saviour arose. But we should offer 1 day a week to God. To worship Him. To give our minds rest on only think of God. That is hard for us these days. We no longer are taught that in church, but in reality we are to take a day of rest. That is what the Sabbath is truly about.
                        The 1st Commandment: Thou shalt have no other gods before me. Could we really just toss that out the window? Whether you are new or old covenant God is the same yesterday today and forever. Our God is still a jealous God. Make no mistake about that.
                        So in my opinion, if you are not keeping the 10 Commandments, please repent. If tomorrow you break Thou shalt not commit adultery the 7th Commandment by lusting after a another person, we must repent of that.
                        Folks, it is the 10 Commandments that we know we are sinning. Jesus made them even tighter. Lust is adultery.
                        I sincerely hope this helps anyone who may read this.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Christian, first I must say welcome to the Board, (I see you've been here a while but haven't posted much)!

                          Secondly, I must ask if you carefully read the previous posts and just didn't comprehend their full meaning and the scripture passages that were presented (trust me I have done that before if I rush my reading) or whether you oppose what you read above? The reason I ask is you compliment many of the responses saying "these are great responses" and then you contradict most of them by trying to uphold the keeping of the Sabbath, which you think is now Sunday instead of Saturday? I know in my youth before I understood the dispensations and covenants, I would have agreed with you somewhat. But, I was confused with scripture then and have a clearer understanding now.

                          BTW - you do realize that the Sabbath was a day of rest. Keeping Sabbath for a lot of Jews during both Testaments meant staying at home because they lived too far away from a synagogue or the Temple (access to these was also due to their time period in history). After Ezra, the rabbis and scribes began adding their rules to Sabbath keeping saying what kind of distances they could walk and for what reasons. Interesting fact: By the time of Jesus, they added 1,500 new rules or laws relating the the Sabbath only! What was mandatory was going to the Temple for, I believe it was, 3 of the 7 feasts, as required by law.

                          If you are contradicting what most have said above, then I ask you this: Why would you think that we do not have to uphold all 613 commandments given to Moses for Israel? God did not group them into classifications, man has. Scripture shows the keeping the Law meant all 613 commandments, not just the 10 graven in stone.

                          Many here are not saying we shouldn't set one day a week to worship God, or even more. What we are saying is that just like the Priesthood changed from the Levites to Mechezadech, when Jesus became the new Priest, not only did the priesthood change, but the laws did. Just like the priest, God ultimately said, scratch all of the old laws, let's begin again. And so, one by one, through Christ and the Apostles, the new laws were added. Many remained the same (because they were upheld individually in the New Testament), but not Sabbath keeping, not animal sacrifice, not food laws. Not animal sacrifice because we now have Jesus' sacrifice. The Temple also changed from one built by men to the very hearts and bodies of people. Gentiles were not required to have circumcision. My final point, Sabbath keeping is not equivalent to the New Testament way of worshiping God one day a week. Sabbath keeping was given to Israel. Setting aside a day of worship (considering one day holier than the others) was given to the Church and like HeIsEnough said, even that was ambigious. Another interesting fact: Many Jewish believers had to work on Sundays (because the custom was still to rest on the Sabbath). They would often meet either after the sun went down on Saturday or early in the morning on Sunday (both times would have been considered the first day of the week).
                          Last edited by Trust&Obey; February 9th, 2018, 08:16 AM.
                          John 14:6
                          Jesus answered, "I am the WAY and the TRUTH and the LIFE, no one comes to the Father except through Me."

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Firefly View Post
                            I was wondering today about the Sabbath. We know from history that the Puritans kept the Sabbath, and for a long time, many businesses stayed closed on Sunday. These current times most people treat Sunday as just another busy day in their week. I have heard that there is a saying now, "Sunday Fun-day". I know people say we don't need to keep the commandment about the Sabbath, but it seems like Christians at least used to honor God more on Sunday than they do now. Probably out of love for Jesus and not for keeping the law. I think in a way it is a shame we don't honor God more on Sundays.
                            Sabbath of course means 'rest'. I believe we keep the Sabbath as we find our rest in Christ and His redemptive work and cease from our 'works' (as in trying to merit salvation).
                            As far as the actual day, it would be Saturday, which is helpful for families and workers to have at least one day a week (pick one) a person can rest and spend with loved ones.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by BorrowedTime View Post
                              Alright guys, time to ask here cause google keeps pulling up SDA interpretations and I can't deal with that headache anymore. Study guides are welcomed and discussion as well.

                              So here are my questions

                              1) If Christ fulfilled the Law (Mosaic) then that should be over and done correct? (Please no red herring "giving license to sin" argument.)

                              2) With verses like Galatians 5:1-4 it seems to imply a need to resist going back to the law as a "yardstick" correct?

                              3) 10 commandments are they or are they not apart of the WHOLE law?

                              4) Is this less confusing than I'm making it?

                              I keep hearing a lot these days that if you refuse to follow the 10 commandments you are not saved (no I don't really care about their opinions regarding that) you are some disobedient heretic. The only other troubling argument is the "we love Christ so we are going to follow them!" which is why I brought up Galatians 5:1-4 and I know we here know about Acts and Peter and James not wanting to yolk Gentiles with something they couldn't even do. To me the Commandments give us great insight into the Holy Holy Holiness of God! When ever I fail at one (not that I try to) it just humbles me to think I can't even keep the basic part of it and Jesus did it fully!

                              The fruit of the Spirit seems to be more of the guideline for us in the Age of the Gentiles correct? Galatians 5:22-23

                              I'll leave this as it is for now as I'm sure more questions will arise.

                              Thank you!
                              Do you think that anyone who has been cleansed of their past sins by the blood of Someone else would ever commit murder? Or steal? Or commit adultery? Or lie?
                              Those "commandments" are written in our hearts...if our hearts have been reborn of Godly seed.

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