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  • #31
    Originally posted by rks7777 View Post
    Who said I didn't fear The Lord? I agree completely with what you are saying about mega churches or any churches that are emergent/new age. I guess my question would be, do you believe that people that attend such a church could be saved? I know we can't make that judgement but I'm curious to your thoughts. I'm sensitive to the idea of being a "perfect christian" since I myself fall short so many times. If I enjoy a particular song from an artist that is emergent/new age, but the song itself is "fine" am I promoting the artists believes or a false doctrine? And what church or individual for that matter is 100% perfect in their doctrine or walk with the Lord? A friend of my sons goes to one of these emergent churches. Their praise and worship time is more like a rock concert. I have no use for it. Again, I prefer the older hymns. But in the end all I'm really concerned about is whether a person is a born again follower of Jesus Christ. I can be as intolerant at times as anyone on the planet. But I've had to let some things go or I wouldn't go to any church at all. Speaking in Tongues, Water Baptism, pre,mid or post trib, etc. there are different views on some many things. I now longer care if I'm right or wrong about these things. I only care if you are walking with the Lord. Maybe I'm wrong and thousands are being led astray. I don't know. But if I hear a worship song and I like the lyrics and I agree with the lyrics I don't really care who wrote or sings it. That's just me. God Bless you and your family
    I did not mean to imply that you didn't fear The Lord!
    It wasn't directed at you, it was just a comment meaning we, meaning "we" as Christians, need to be very careful how we walk in light of His Word because it is easy to be deceived. We are warned over and over again how many will be deceived, how many false teachers and wolves will be in the midst of the Church, not outside the Church, but "in" the Church.

    I don't think it matters what I believe if someone could be saved in such a Church. It matters what God's Word says and I know He is not pleased with Churches such as these, those who are using His Word to their own gain. I know He gives great warning in Scripture to the Church, to it's leaders and to us.

    We all fall short, but, again, it isn't about us, it is about teaching and preaching God's Word, the whole counsel of God's Word, it's about Him and when we stray from His Word we increase our chances from straying from living the way He commands us to live and that is to love Him, not the world, we are not to love this world but to search Him out with all of our hearts and live according to His Word!
    I am far from being perfect, boy, the longer I live the more I hate this body and my flesh..... I hate my sin, I hate sin, I don't find this world to offer much at all, I mean sure God created a beautiful earth and all it's glory, but, I also see what sin has caused, all it's suffering and all it's hate and evil. This is not our home, I am longing for His return, for when sin will be no more.
    It's been like this for a long time, but, it grows stronger and stronger all the time and the more I am in His Word and the closer I draw nearer to Him, the more I am longing to be out of this big old sinful world.
    We must not take our eyes off of Him and Satan is always looking for ways to get our eyes off of God! He is cunning, and we must be careful lest we be deceived!
    I see many who are deceived, at least it seems this way to me and we need to be careful and warn others and preach the Word, not just sugar coat it.
    I'm not trying to preach at you, I'm just sharing my thoughts and concerns. I love people, I want people to know that God loves them and offers salvation to those who will believe. And, I see too many Christians who profess to be Christians and yet they don't act like a Bible believing Christian and I know that we are all at different growth times in our walk with Him, but, I know people who have been Christians for way, way longer than I have (decades) and like I mentioned in an earlier post with some who don't want anything to do with us. There is no love. It's all about their agendas, it seems to be their status in the Church, a social gospel, tickling of ears and entertainment?

    Has God's Word taken root in their lives? Did it fall to the wayside? Is it only a head knowledge and not a heart change? Even when we look at the fruit in their lives, we still don't know, we can't judge them on their salvation... but, we can still have some idea, we need to be careful though. I ask this question.... Why, if they are true born again Christians, why don't they want to listen to "any" concerns that any other Christians may have about God's Word! I mean it is God's Word after all, not my opinion or the opinion of someone else when we use His Word, right out of the Bible??
    God gives clear instruction and I believe it is clear, on how we should live, it's all in the Bible.
    Why are they so concerned about getting people from the world to come into the Church by using all kinds of gimmicks, entertainment and when you mention sitting down and doing a bible study, right out of the Bible they don't seem interested because people won't want to come?
    What about dealing with sin in the Church? How many Churches want to do this? When I have spoken to our sons, who profess to be Christians, when I have brought up Scripture with them about obedience, they are offended. Many years ago, I found out that the Church, the Pastor actually was notinterested in warning the Church about the dangers of any unbiblical teaching.
    Many Churches are starting to look like the world, we need to pray.

    It really does break my heart and I'm sure it's not pleasing God either... We've lost our boys, we don't see them, they've disowned us, we are shunned by the Church, we are judged and criticized, we don't see our 4 grand children, the Church does not care at all, they are doing the same with us and are aware of how things are with our son and dil, they are all in the same Church family.
    It is not my opinion that matters, it is God's Word that has the final authority! God's Word is truth and it's pretty hard to argue against His Word!

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by Trust&Obey View Post
      Roger - it seems that though we've never met, we have walked a similar path. I can't say, though, that my path has distanced me to the extent that yours has from family. Although, I also have shadows of that as well. It truly is heartbreaking and if we are not careful, it can be overwhelming. Rather coincidentally, I also ran into the issue of Calvanism/Lordship Salvation that ultimately meant leaving my home church. In six years from that time only one person reached out to me - and that just a couple of weeks ago. Unlike most stories, my home church hired and then fired a minister who was emergent and into the Lordship Salvation doctrine. It took them awhile, but most were glad to see him leave. I had given warnings to the pastor search committee, but they were blind to all of my arguments. There really is no other word but blind....but now 6 years later, I have hope that I might return to this church and that their arms will be open wide. Keep praying. He can do the impossible! And even if He doesn't open doors to your family and relatives, only He can comfort you.


      Thank you also for starting this discussion.
      And, thank you also for sharing, I believe you did a better job in saying what I wanted to say. And, it does seem our paths are similar and I do pray that God open up a door for you to return to Church and that you will be received with open arms. We do have to trust Him, sometimes I think we can try to hard instead of surrendering our whole lives to Him. Trying to have things our way in our time, we are growing up in Him and we must remember that as well.
      It is a sad when families are torn apart, it is not God's plan that it be that way, but, even when we try our best, it seems that our best still isn't enough. We have tried to love as God has commanded us to love, we have tried to be at peace with them, but, it seems that even that has not been enough.
      There is a pushing away and a constant criticizing and it has been a great detriment to ongoing health issues and when it starts to impact one's ability to function it seems like the only thing to do now is to step back and let go. Otherwise there is always anxiety and stress and a decline in health, while all the while not knowing what to say or do or ask or don't ask and always apologizing. It seems like some people want to keep you in a place of guilt and shame and condemnation, while they control your life and we've struggled greatly, being gentle, humble and not withholding our love and affections.
      But, also going to Scripture and believing that if they confess to be Christians, whether they are or not, they have been given the gospel, we've confronted, we've shared Scripture. It's been a vicious cycle like this for 10 years and I'm not sure I can go on like this anymore, we are both tired and exhausted!

      Yes, I believe we need to stand on God's Word! It has been hard to walk at times, feeling confused on which approach to take, to love them, but, to also speak truth, to be humble, but again, if we are always loving and accepting and humble but don't stand for truth then what are we doing?

      A huge struggle was whether they are true believers or not and not knowing exactly how to approach them as Scripture instructs differently for believers and unbelievers. I'm praying, and yes God can do the impossible. He loves them more than I do, they belong to Him and I know that His will is for them to turn to Him.
      He is our peace (Shalom) (Eph.2: 14)

      Comment


      • #33
        The last 6 years have had their effect on me as well. In many ways I feel like a shell of the person I once was. Empty at times. Illness alone can do that, but the stress of broken relationships took its toll as well. But I know that I feel this most when I'm focusing on myself and not God!

        God has brought me through it all!!! I say that even when I still feel "in" many trials. His strength is perfect, truly, when our strength is gone.
        John 14:6
        Jesus answered, "I am the WAY and the TRUTH and the LIFE, no one comes to the Father except through Me."

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by Roger View Post


          It really does break my heart and I'm sure it's not pleasing God either... We've lost our boys, we don't see them, they've disowned us, we are shunned by the Church, we are judged and criticized, we don't see our 4 grand children, the Church does not care at all, they are doing the same with us and are aware of how things are with our son and dil, they are all in the same Church family.
          It is not my opinion that matters, it is God's Word that has the final authority! God's Word is truth and it's pretty hard to argue against His Word!
          I am so sorry to hear about your sons and grandsons....I know so many folks whose families have been torn apart and generations totally disconnected from one another...it breaks my heart. It did not used to be like this. Families are being destroyed...I suppose this is part of the End Times...My sister has not spoken to my 84 year old mother in about 18 months.Praying for you and your family.

          Comment


          • #35
            Roger

            This was my Grandma's favorite hymn. I agree it's a great one!

            What a Friend We Have in Jesus https://www.hymnal.net/en/hymn/h/789

            What a Friend we have in Jesus,
            All our sins and griefs to bear!
            What a privilege to carry
            Everything to God in prayer!
            O what peace we often forfeit,
            O what needless pain we bear,
            All because we do not carry
            Everything to God in prayer!

            Have we trials and temptations?
            Is there trouble anywhere?
            We should never be discouraged,
            Take it to the Lord in prayer.
            Can we find a friend so faithful
            Who will all our sorrows share?
            Jesus knows our every weakness,
            Take it to the Lord in prayer.

            Are we weak and heavy-laden,
            Cumbered with a load of care?
            Precious Savior, still our refuge—
            Take it to the Lord in prayer;
            Do thy friends despise, forsake thee?
            Take it to the Lord in prayer;
            In His arms He’ll take and shield thee,
            Thou wilt find a solace there.
            John 14:6
            Jesus answered, "I am the WAY and the TRUTH and the LIFE, no one comes to the Father except through Me."

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by Roger View Post
              I did not mean to imply that you didn't fear The Lord!
              It wasn't directed at you, it was just a comment meaning we, meaning "we" as Christians, need to be very careful how we walk in light of His Word because it is easy to be deceived. We are warned over and over again how many will be deceived, how many false teachers and wolves will be in the midst of the Church, not outside the Church, but "in" the Church.

              I don't think it matters what I believe if someone could be saved in such a Church. It matters what God's Word says and I know He is not pleased with Churches such as these, those who are using His Word to their own gain. I know He gives great warning in Scripture to the Church, to it's leaders and to us.

              We all fall short, but, again, it isn't about us, it is about teaching and preaching God's Word, the whole counsel of God's Word, it's about Him and when we stray from His Word we increase our chances from straying from living the way He commands us to live and that is to love Him, not the world, we are not to love this world but to search Him out with all of our hearts and live according to His Word!
              I am far from being perfect, boy, the longer I live the more I hate this body and my flesh..... I hate my sin, I hate sin, I don't find this world to offer much at all, I mean sure God created a beautiful earth and all it's glory, but, I also see what sin has caused, all it's suffering and all it's hate and evil. This is not our home, I am longing for His return, for when sin will be no more.
              It's been like this for a long time, but, it grows stronger and stronger all the time and the more I am in His Word and the closer I draw nearer to Him, the more I am longing to be out of this big old sinful world.
              We must not take our eyes off of Him and Satan is always looking for ways to get our eyes off of God! He is cunning, and we must be careful lest we be deceived!
              I see many who are deceived, at least it seems this way to me and we need to be careful and warn others and preach the Word, not just sugar coat it.
              I'm not trying to preach at you, I'm just sharing my thoughts and concerns. I love people, I want people to know that God loves them and offers salvation to those who will believe. And, I see too many Christians who profess to be Christians and yet they don't act like a Bible believing Christian and I know that we are all at different growth times in our walk with Him, but, I know people who have been Christians for way, way longer than I have (decades) and like I mentioned in an earlier post with some who don't want anything to do with us. There is no love. It's all about their agendas, it seems to be their status in the Church, a social gospel, tickling of ears and entertainment?

              Has God's Word taken root in their lives? Did it fall to the wayside? Is it only a head knowledge and not a heart change? Even when we look at the fruit in their lives, we still don't know, we can't judge them on their salvation... but, we can still have some idea, we need to be careful though. I ask this question.... Why, if they are true born again Christians, why don't they want to listen to "any" concerns that any other Christians may have about God's Word! I mean it is God's Word after all, not my opinion or the opinion of someone else when we use His Word, right out of the Bible??
              God gives clear instruction and I believe it is clear, on how we should live, it's all in the Bible.
              Why are they so concerned about getting people from the world to come into the Church by using all kinds of gimmicks, entertainment and when you mention sitting down and doing a bible study, right out of the Bible they don't seem interested because people won't want to come?
              What about dealing with sin in the Church? How many Churches want to do this? When I have spoken to our sons, who profess to be Christians, when I have brought up Scripture with them about obedience, they are offended. Many years ago, I found out that the Church, the Pastor actually was notinterested in warning the Church about the dangers of any unbiblical teaching.
              Many Churches are starting to look like the world, we need to pray.

              It really does break my heart and I'm sure it's not pleasing God either... We've lost our boys, we don't see them, they've disowned us, we are shunned by the Church, we are judged and criticized, we don't see our 4 grand children, the Church does not care at all, they are doing the same with us and are aware of how things are with our son and dil, they are all in the same Church family.
              It is not my opinion that matters, it is God's Word that has the final authority! God's Word is truth and it's pretty hard to argue against His Word!
              You're a good man Roger and have a beautiful walk with the Lord. I wish I knew you personally. I too am estranged from my oldest son and his wife and my 2 grandchildren. They are Christians but for some reason we have been ostracized. We haven't seen them in over a year and have only seen them a few times in the past 3 years. It breaks my heart. As I study the bible, it's clear that this is not how it should be. I will pray for you and your family to have healing and reconciliation but not at a compromise to the God's Word. God Bless you and your family.

              Comment


              • #37
                Here is a quote from an article posted on RR at http://rr-bb.com/showthread.php?2016...old-Ministries

                Infiltration
                The influence of NAR has become broader, and therefore more dangerous, as many of its ideas are being accepted by traditionally non-charismatic churches and organizations. This acceptance is due to a number of factors.
                • Bethel, Hillsong and IHOP music has found enthusiastic reception in churches, youth ministries and among young adults throughout the evangelical spectrum.
                • Many have no understanding of the teachings of NAR and no concept of what it is.
                • Influential NAR teachers and books are making in-roads into evangelical circles.
                • Due to rampant biblical illiteracy and general apathy toward Scripture and theology, fewer Christians are alarmed or even aware that false teaching and deception is taking place. Not surprisingly those who attempt to warn about NAR or other false teachings are often vilified and labeled as negative, legalistic and haters.
                John 14:6
                Jesus answered, "I am the WAY and the TRUTH and the LIFE, no one comes to the Father except through Me."

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by Trust&Obey View Post
                  Here is a quote from an article posted on RR at http://rr-bb.com/showthread.php?2016...old-Ministries
                  excellent article....thanks for posting

                  Comment

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