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  • #16
    Originally posted by RandallB View Post
    Agreed.

    My question is: What happens if they agree to the CC distinctives but then go off on an Emergent tangent?
    I know there have been churches that have been asked to stop using the CC name. I assume if the problem is bad enough they would also be asked to stop using the name.
    For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. 1 Cor 1:18

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Jlutz View Post
      I know there have been churches that have been asked to stop using the CC name. I assume if the problem is bad enough they would also be asked to stop using the name.
      That is good.

      The NT model of churches has the pastor of the church accountable to their Seeding organization. That was Paul in most cases.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Jlutz View Post
        All CC have to agree to the CC distinctives or they cannot use the name
        That is not what I have seen done here in Australia.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by RandallB View Post
          Agreed.

          My question is: What happens if they agree to the CC distinctives but then go off on an Emergent tangent?
          Well let me tell you what happened in just such a case. Chuck Smith is the founding pastor of the first Calvary Chapel and his church is located in Costa Mesa, CA. He has a son, Chuck Smith, Jr. who is also a pastor and was so of a church Calvary Chapel, San Juan Capistrano in California. Jr. led his church into the emergent church movement. Sr. promptly addressed the situation with Jr. and Jr. wouldn't budge from it. They parted ways and that church in San Juan is no longer part of Calvary Chapel. I think that says it all.

          I will say that it was a very painful time in our church because of this. We felt we were losing a dear family member (and we were). Calvary Chapel, Costa Mesa, CA was my church before I moved out of California. I know the Calvary Chapel way very well. And if there are churches out there that are diverting from the established distinctives they will be dealt with.

          There is a very good reason why the Calvary Chapel movement has grown largely all over the world--because they carry sound Biblical teaching. The Word of God is first and foremost and that is the focus (along with evangelism). In my opinion that is a win-win situation.

          And Misty--you might try sending an e-mail to Chuck Smith, Sr's church and let them know what is going on. Perhaps they are already addressing it, but the end result of that has not been made public yet. They take things like this very seriously. And that is quite correct-divert from the distinctives and you cannot use the name.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by RandallB View Post
            My question is: What happens if they agree to the CC distinctives but then go off on an Emergent tangent?
            Originally posted by Jlutz View Post
            I know there have been churches that have been asked to stop using the CC name. I assume if the problem is bad enough they would also be asked to stop using the name.
            Though each is independent, they are still to be in agreement with Distinctives. http://biblefacts.org/church/Distinctives.pdf

            If they do not, and they are known to the association of churches it becomes a matter where they can be reported. They will be contacted and hopefully the correction will yield fruit.

            Here is what should happen next, if a CC you know of is not in agreement with what CC is known to teach, look up your regional area pastor and email them with the specifics. I am a CC pastor and you can also pm me if you have trouble contacting them.

            Here is a link.

            http://calvarychapelassociation.com/...al-leadership/

            There is a whole bunch going on in the modern church and Scripture tells us apostasy will be what grips the end times church and CC's are not immune. Thank God for Bereans within the church.
            There is One King, and He is not this guy. sigpic

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            • #21
              Originally posted by RandallB View Post
              Does anybody know if the CC Parent Church can exercise theological control over a CC daughter Church in cases where the Daughter church strays from CC principles?

              Revoke their ability to use the CC name or use of the Dove trademark?
              Yes. There are guidelines for all potential pastors and church planters. Go to www.calvarychapel.com and look it up. You can always look up Calvary Chapel, Costa Mesa, CA, which is pastored by Chuck Smith, Sr. and who is the founding pastor of the CC movement. He is my old pastor. I sat under him for a long enough time to where I got to see just where he stood on many issues. And emergent church, purpose driven church stuff doesn't fly. As a matter of fact, before I came to CC Costa Mesa, I came to the Lord at Saddleback Church, which is Rick Warren's church. And I was only there a year before the Lord moved me out of there. What I got to see is how that church operated--(many spiritually starving people there). And I remember telling some of the associate pastors I was going to be moving and was going to go to his church. They scoffed under their breaths with comments like, "Ah yes--Pastor Chuck." I didn't understand what they meant at the time. I was too new of a believer and very hungry for the truth of the Word. But after a short time at Calvary I got what they meant--they scoffed at him because he was not "purpose driven." He was an expository preacher/teacher and was into one translation and the truth of the Word. Warren's church is into topical teaching (which is fine), but fill-ins on a sheet of paper handed out each sermon and six or seven translations used to get his point across. Absolutely confusing to a new believer...

              As for using the CC name and their trademark? Nope. Gotta follow the guidelines or you can't use the name. Chuck Smith's own son had a church in San Juan Capistrano, CA and decided to follow the emergent church movement. Dad and son had a falling out over this and son went on his way. No use of name. So if it's good enough for the son to have to move on, you can bet it's that way for anyone else.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Biblebabe View Post
                Yes. There are guidelines for all potential pastors and church planters. Go to www.calvarychapel.com and look it up. You can always look up Calvary Chapel, Costa Mesa, CA, which is pastored by Chuck Smith, Sr. and who is the founding pastor of the CC movement. He is my old pastor. I sat under him for a long enough time to where I got to see just where he stood on many issues. And emergent church, purpose driven church stuff doesn't fly. As a matter of fact, before I came to CC Costa Mesa, I came to the Lord at Saddleback Church, which is Rick Warren's church. And I was only there a year before the Lord moved me out of there. What I got to see is how that church operated--(many spiritually starving people there). And I remember telling some of the associate pastors I was going to be moving and was going to go to his church. They scoffed under their breaths with comments like, "Ah yes--Pastor Chuck." I didn't understand what they meant at the time. I was too new of a believer and very hungry for the truth of the Word. But after a short time at Calvary I got what they meant--they scoffed at him because he was not "purpose driven." He was an expository preacher/teacher and was into one translation and the truth of the Word. Warren's church is into topical teaching (which is fine), but fill-ins on a sheet of paper handed out each sermon and six or seven translations used to get his point across. Absolutely confusing to a new believer...

                As for using the CC name and their trademark? Nope. Gotta follow the guidelines or you can't use the name. Chuck Smith's own son had a church in San Juan Capistrano, CA and decided to follow the emergent church movement. Dad and son had a falling out over this and son went on his way. No use of name. So if it's good enough for the son to have to move on, you can bet it's that way for anyone else.
                So why now is Pastor Chuck and Greg Laurie aligning themselves with Rick Warren. I wish someone could answer that question for me. I went to the church leadership at Harvest and asked them myself, as the Bible instructs me to do and I got ostracized and made to feel like I was not a Christian by asking. Never did get an answer but needless to say I left that church as I refuse to follow men rather than God and I feel they are going down the wrong path by alligning with seeker sensitive Purpose Driven Rick Warren
                Jeremiah 32:27
                Behold, I am the Lord, the God of all flesh, is there anything too hard for Me?


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                • #23
                  Doesn't Chuck Smith continue to align himself with Billy Graham also? That was one of those moments for me when I was listening to his talks on the Calvary Chapel radio station.

                  I was just reading through an earlier thread on BG here in the RR forum that goes into more detail:

                  http://rr-bb.com/showthread.php?1476...t=billy+graham

                  There were other flags, his lack of understanding regarding the Catholic Church and Freemasonry, to name a couple.

                  Needless to say I no longer listen to that station.
                  sigpic
                  PLEASE PRAY FOR MY UNSAVED FAMILY MEMBERS - THANK YOU AND GOD BLESS

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by standfortruth View Post
                    So why now is Pastor Chuck and Greg Laurie aligning themselves with Rick Warren. I wish someone could answer that question for me. I went to the church leadership at Harvest and asked them myself, as the Bible instructs me to do and I got ostracized and made to feel like I was not a Christian by asking. Never did get an answer but needless to say I left that church as I refuse to follow men rather than God and I feel they are going down the wrong path by alligning with seeker sensitive Purpose Driven Rick Warren
                    Greg and Chuck are quite different regarding RW. Greg does, knowingly, speak alongside him and argues that we have no reason to distance himself from him. Chuck on the other hand has not sought him out, nor desires that level of relationship. At the 2009 Harvest Crusade and the recent Pastor's Perspective Chuck was not in on RW being put on the same platform or in the same room with the guy.

                    Greg is a source of great frustration for us who hate seeing sheep confused as to whom they should listen. Greg serves up a heaping pile of confusion and the devil is loving the fallout from it. Chuck, on the other hand, is also being set up for confusion among the movement, but unlike Greg, is not desiring to have it all happen.
                    There is One King, and He is not this guy. sigpic

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